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Re: Re: Merge dialog

From: Simon Large <simon.tortoisesvn_at_googlemail.com>
Date: 2007-10-21 00:11:51 CEST

On 20/10/2007, Alexander Klenin <klenin@gmail.com> wrote:
> Sorry for such a stubbornness on my part, I honestly feel my
> usability concerns are legitimate ones --
> but maybe I am wrong and worry about nothing.
> Anyway, just one last attempt from me, and I promise to shup up,
> at least until I have a chance to test a wizard mode ;-)
> On 10/19/07, Stefan Küng <tortoisesvn@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > But this IS settings and options for merge command.
> >
> > A setting is something you set once, then forget about it.
> > This is definitely not a setting: each merge is different.
> Yes, some settings stay the same for a long time
> and some are changed more often -- but which are which depends on
> concrete usage, and it is not optimal to force all users into the
> 'stupid first-novice' category who need to re-check everything every time
> in a pre-determined fixed order.

The 'stupid novice' category is to disable merging competely ;-)

But seriously, the point Stefan is making is that with the old dialog
all the settings were visible. With a tabbed view, you have to click
on the tabs to see what is there.

> I, for one, do not remember if I ever changed "Ignore ancestry" setting.
> As another example, "Ignore eols" is just as much a setting as it is
> in TortoiseMerge.
> Yet another example -- for me 'From URL' changes each time,
> but for developers working on branches, this URL never changes.

That won't be a problem - the URL will be remembered, as it is now, so
just click next.

> > > Most users will simply click on "Next" and NOT check
> > > settings any more after first two or three times using the wizard.
> > But they still *see* the page - if something would be completely
> > wrong, they might notice it even though they just click on "next".
> Yes, they might, or they might not -- attention to such details really get
> blurred after tenth time you click through the same pages.
> Imagine you have to uninstall/reinstall the same application ten times a day,
> each time changing one setting buried inside a 4-step wizard.
> Would you not wish that setting to be accessible directly?

Well, you have a point. We avoid having 'Are you sure?', 'No really,
are you sure you're sure?' dialogs because after a while people click
through without reading them. So in that sense, tabs are no worse than
the wizard.

But compared with the time required to show a log or get a URL using
repo browser, the time to click Next is completely insignificant.

> > > Sorry, but it that sense the wizard is even worse, since it makes
> > > harder to get back and
> > > check some setting if you start having doubts on the last tab.
> > One click on "Back" and you're there. That's hard?
> No, you have to click "Back" one to three times,
> and then click "Next" the same number of times to return to the last tab.

Novices have doubts ;-) If you're always doing the same type of
merge, you never want to change the first page, so at most it is 2
clicks. If you got the first page wrong, you would know immediately on
the second page.

> > > All I ask for is an option, you can totally hide tabs in wizard mode.
> > > I know the options are bad, but this one is really important to me ;-)
> >
> > Don't forget that in tab-mode, you would see both the revrange and the
> > treemerge pages - which one will get used? Don't say you want a
> > checkbox to choose between those two...
> If I understood correctly, the first tab will consist of exactly that checkbox?
> So TSVN might, for example,
> display both pages as separate tabs, but enable controls
> only on the one corresponding to the first page selection.

The first version of the wizard should be available tomorrow so maybe
we should continue this discussion after trying it.


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Received on Sun Oct 21 00:12:01 2007

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