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Re: Running SVN 1.9.x on ASF servers?

From: Tony Stevenson <pctony_at_apache.org>
Date: Sat, 10 Oct 2015 09:14:17 +0100


For quite some time (well over 18 months now) the Infrastructure team has a policy that we will only deploy products, from packages stored in an accessible repo.

By default this only includes upstream suppliers from the OS. The OS is currently Ubuntu 14.04 - so by default we will only ship the latest version available in the repo.

However that said we are allowed to build our own packages and deploy those from an apt repo that we manage too.

If we do this, of course the package needs to be 100% safe to roll forwards and backwards. So full dependency management, clean install and removal. Etc etc.

To be clear. We will not just deploy some code anymore. This is because the work has to be completely idempotent and totally reproducible each and every time.

The httpd project were also affected by this - as we used to run trunk there. The team has moved on from this, as while it was nice to let folks do this, it added a non-insignificant burden on the Infra team to support it. Plus we have also be tasked with improving the infrastructure, making it more stable, more resilient, and less blocked on individuals. It also needs to fit in with our policy of using puppet to manage production services.

Given our recent (relatively) pain points with our subversion hosts (not the code) we'd be less likely today to just push out a 1.9.x beta release into production.

Please also remember that between the svn service and the mail service we have our by far two biggest services historically. This adds (rightly or wrongly) a higher barrier to entry as we are more sensitive about screwing them up.

What I will say is that:

- if you guys produced a .deb package that did all the things above
- this .deb was hosted in a repo we'd happily pull from
- the subversion project were willing to support the upgrade process and were available if the fan was to meet the shit
- you accept that if we feel we cannot resolve any issues without rolling back - we will do just that.

If you can do this. You may well find us saying yes that much more easily.

Please also remember that we have SLAs we have to work towards - so upgrades need be announced a minimum of 72hours prior, but the more the better.

I am happy to continue this thread if you want to ask more questions. But the 'it must be a package' - 'from a repo we trust' - 'all changes managed by puppet' are firm policies that we will not shift from.

So if you can work within those constraints we might be able to do something.


On behalf of the Apache Infrastructure Team

Sent from my iPhone

> On 10 Oct 2015, at 08:17, Branko Čibej <brane_at_apache.org> wrote:
> Copying Infra on this. No amount of crying on this list will help if we
> don't tell Infra that we're not happy.
> TL;DR: Why are not the ASF Subversion servers running the latest and
> greatest version of Subversion?
> -- Brane
>> On 10.10.2015 00:37, bert_at_qqmail.nl wrote:
>> And since then we lost most custom patches to things like the commit mailer, because policy changed to standardize on using the standard distributions...
>> No more nice summaries of what is merged, but just raw diff output. And still no proper handling of copies, so every pre-copy property is mentioned as property change.
>> Requests to fix this, should now just be forwarded upstream, etc.
>> I'm not sure if that promise still holds...
>> Bert
>> From: Philip Martin
>> Sent: vrijdag 9 oktober 2015 23:47
>> To: Bert Huijben
>> Cc: Mark Phippard;Subversion Development
>> Subject: Re: Running SVN 1.9.x on ASF servers?
>> Bert Huijben <bert_at_qqmail.nl> writes:
>>> I think we have a chicken and egg problem here :(
>>> The ASF waits until the distributions update... And the distributions
>>> don't update to 1.9 because we apparently don't think it is stable
>>> because we don't update ourselves.
>> When we first discussed the move into the ASF repository:
>> http://svn.haxx.se/dev/archive-2009-11/0259.shtml
>> * Infra is willing to run our release candidates on the main repos, so
>> we don't need a special server for that. they're pretty much willing
>> to run anything we ask for (alpha? beta?), but that obviously means
>> we better be *damned* sure it won't lose or corrupt the repo :-)
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: "Mark Phippard" <markphip_at_gmail.com>
>> Sent: ‎9-‎10-‎2015 20:21
>> To: "Subversion Development" <dev_at_subversion.apache.org>
>> Subject: Running SVN 1.9.x on ASF servers?
>> Does anyone know if/when it is planned to update the ASF servers to Subversion 1.9?
>> The Apache headers say it is still running 1.8.1. Is that true? Or is it a patched version of 1.8.1 at least?
Received on 2015-10-10 10:14:24 CEST

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